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Second Stimulus Check For Obama 2009 Economic Stimulus Package?

Published 2/4/09 (Modified 3/9/11)
By MoneyBlueBook

Tax Cuts, Social Spending, and New Jobs - But What About Stimulus Checks?

A second economic stimulus package for 2009 is on the way and from the looks of things in the news, it appears newly minted President Barack H. Obama and his Democrat controlled House of Representatives and U.S. Senate are determined to ram the lucrative spending proposals through the legislative meat grinder no matter what, much to the chagrin of skeptical and deficit-weary Congressional Republicans.

As Congress debates the wisdom and intricate details of the current version of the 2009 economic stimulus package, it's clear that something needs to be done very soon to jumpstart and save our suffering economy before we spiral into a full blown economic depression. The unemployment rate is rising fast and everywhere you turn, there seems to be a never ending stream of unemployment and layoff news being announced everyday. The stock market has already shed more than half of its value since its peak in 2007, and billions to trillions of dollars worth of wealth have already been eliminated from the economy. Major banks and financial giants like Citibank, Bank of America, and JP Morgan Chase, once the financial pillars of our economy and the lifeblood of our credit industry, are now clinging onto U.S. government bailout money for dear life - hoping to still be in business at the end of every quarter.

With its almost limitless resources, it's clear the federal government must intervene somehow and put this broken economy and financial system back on track to prosperity. But the question is - what should be the government's role in all of this? More specially, what method should the government take to effectively jump start the economy to life again and ease the suffering on Main Street and Wall Street? Should the 2nd economic stimulus package continue to focus directly on sparking consumer spending by featuring a second round of free stimulus checks to consumers - perhaps for amounts much higher than the previous 2008 economic stimulus checks? Or should the plan this time around focus more on longer term indirect measures like job creation, infrastructure investment, and tax credits?

Current 2009 Economic Stimulus Package Focuses Less On Stimulus Checks - And More On Job Creation, Infrastructure Projects, and Tax Cuts

Before Barack Obama was elected president and during his 2008 Presidential election campaign, he supported implementing additional economic stimulus measures in 2009 - and even whispered at the rumored possibility of a second round of stimulus checks for taxpaying consumers in 2009 before tax day.

Whether a second stimulus check was a real possibility or not, the mere mention of a second round of stimulus payments and the prospect of getting more free government money certainly made my greedy ears perk up, but much of my optimism and enthusiasm were quickly dashed when Obama finally came into power. Almost immediately, he signaled a different stimulus proposal shift that favored a more multi-pronged approach of using tax cuts, tax credits, and pet projects, rather than relying on the 2008 economic stimulus check tactics of his predecessor, George W. Bush. Instead of just distributing free bailout money to the masses and hoping the funds will naturally trigger a huge surge in consumer spending activity to put the economy back on its feet again, Obama's stimulus package focuses more on middle class tax cuts and massive increases in government spending to fund various infrastructure investments, green energy projects, financial aid to states, and social education initiatives - designed to create jobs and put people back to work.

The current 2nd economic stimulus plan laid down by President Obama for 2009 is a whopping, super-sized $825 billion economic rescue package containing staggering spending initiatives and ambitious tax cuts, and sprinkled with dozens of pork-based proposals and suspect social initiatives within hundreds of pages of legislation. The current package contains $300 billion worth of aggressive construction projects designed to improve the country's���� infrastructure and create millions of new artificially generated jobs in areas like health care, renewable green energy, school upgrades and repairs, and transportation related improvements. The package also contains about $200 billion worth of state social assistance provisions designed to help keep state sponsored health and unemployment programs well funded - to offer a measure of cushion for those people who have been recently laid off due to the economic down turn. Along with the state assistance portion are other safety net type provisions to help fund and keep afloat local food stamp programs, food banks, state sponsored health care, and governmental health insurance plans for those suddenly unemployed.

The other primary feature of the current Obama economic stimulus plan is the series of tax cuts and tax credits offered to qualifying individuals and small businesses. Under the tax cut portion of the stimulus deal, small businesses suffering losses because of the economic downturn and recession would receive more favorable tax loss write off terms.

For individuals, the current 2009 economic stimulus package offers pretty generous tax cutting proposals. The plan highly favors low and middle-income working families since the idea is that these income groups are more likely to spend and invest their tax savings rather than save the money. In terms of stimulating the economy, increased consumer spending is good, and consumer saving is bad. Nicknamed the "Make Work Pay Credit" by President Obama, the proposed tax credit is supposed to reach close to 95% of workers, and benefit even working tax filers without any tax liability - typically very low income workers. Here is a basic overview of the stimulus plan's Make Work Pay Credit:

  • Middle Class Tax Credit: Under the plan, there would be a tax cut amounting to $500 a year for individuals, and $1,000 for couples. The economic stimulus would be issued in the form of a tax credit, and would be limited to those making $75,000 or less ($150,000 or less for married workers filing joint tax returns).
  • Low Income Tax Credit: For low income taxpayers, there would be an increase and expansion of the Earned Income Tax Credit to provide a refundable tax credit for low income assistance. The expansion would affect even working tax filers without any actual net tax liability - typically very low-income workers - and allow them to potentially qualify for free stimulus tax refund credits.
  • Child Tax Credit: For those who have children, a temporary increase in the child tax credit would result in larger tax refunds.

Should The 2009 Economic Stimulus Plan Be Re-Written Or Re-Packaged To Contain Major Provisions For A Second Economic Stimulus Check?

It's too bad the eventual 2009 stimulus plan probably won't contain another round of hefty stimulus check payments to ordinary consumers like the ones that were dished out last year. While the 2008 stimulus tax rebate wasn't much (only a few hundred dollars in my case), some additional government handouts in higher dollar denominations would still have been greatly appreciated by individuals like myself and put to good use. Plus, as an American consumer who embraces the virtues of capitalism, I feel I would have made a better decision for myself as to how best spend my portion of the stimulus money pursuant to what's in my own best capitalist self interest.

Overall, I think President Obama's administration is probably right in its revised efforts to focus more on job creation, offering greater tax cuts, and enhancing safety net protections to help suffering Americans survive the economic downturn for the long term. Offering greater financial assistance to struggling state unemployment programs (many on them on the verge of running out of funds), and stimulating growth with more job building projects is a proven way to stabilize the markets and improve consumer sentiment. However, I'm still a bit disappointed that the President and Congress have not explored the prospect of an enhanced second stimulus check further.

At least for now, President Obama's administration seems to have given up on the idea of using government stimulus checks en masse again to jump start the economy. Instead, Obama's advisers have indicated that they would prefer searching for viable ways to get government stimulus money into the hands of American taxpayers quickly that would not require or duplicate the tax rebate checks of last year. Apparently the $150 billion spent in 2008 in the form of stimulus payments to consumers proved to be quite an economic failure and pointless exercise of futility in terms of actually stimulating the economy to any extended degree. But perhaps the reason it didn't work properly the first time around was because too little money was given out to substantially change consumer spending habits to forcibly inject money back into the economy again (simply compare the $150 billion spent last year to the $800 billion-plus worth of spending being proposed for 2009).

Perhaps The Problem With The First Stimulus Checks In 2008 Was That They Were Too Little To Make Much Of An Impact

I have mixed feelings about the prospect of yet another around of direct stimulus checks to consumers. On one hand, I understand that there are many struggling American families getting hammered by higher living���� costs, and suffering from the ills of unemployment and layoffs. However, I'm not entirely convinced that the idea of handing out free money to families will really solve all of our economic woes and jump start the economy at its core. But yet I still wonder if perhaps we gave up on the idea of stimulus checks too early and that maybe, the concept is still workable. Maybe the amounts issued in 2008 were simply to small to change anyone's spending habits as initially intended - after all, only about $150 billion was spent in 2008, when the current 2009 economic stimulus proposal's already ballooned to a whopping $850 billion.

I know when I received my tax rebate stimulus check in early 2008, the check only amounted to a few hundred paltry dollars - not really enough for me to go on a greedy spending spree. So instead of spending it and doing my part to stimulate the economy, I ended up doing what most people probably ended up doing with their tax rebate check - putting the money in a bank and depositing it into a high yield savings account. Of course, my plans for the money would likely have been very different if the amount wasn't something low like $300, $600, or $1,200, but rather something as high as $10,000. If the stimulus check issued to me was indeed worth upwards of $10,000, I would very likely have saved a small portion of it but ended up plowing a sizable portion back into the economy by spending it on major expenditures like a new wide screen plasma TV set, new home appliances, or even a new car.

What If The Entire Economic Stimulus Bailout Package Went Towards 2nd Stimulus Check Payments? Would This Actually Stimulate The Economy?

Almost all polls among ordinary American consumers show overwhelming support for a second stimulus rebate check. After all, who would really oppose it? Who would be opposed to receiving free stimulus check money. Think the prospect of getting a second stimulus check worth as high as $10,000 as a consumer bailout is impossible? Well it's probably unlikely, but it's not out of the realm of financial or budgetary possibility, at least based on the fiscal numbers alone.

On CNN Money, a very interesting question was proposed in regards to the bank bailout and economic stimulus packages. If instead of bailing out these credit crisis-stricken banks (who probably deserve their fates due to the risky mortgage bets they greedily placed into subprime loans), we just gave all of the bailout money to taxpayers in the form of a massive consumer cash stimulus. How much would we each get if the entire current economic stimulus proposals were issued out to consumers as a second round of stimulus check payments? The second important question to ask is - would this actually stimulate the economy for the necessary extended period of time to get it going again?

To arrive at the figure, CNN Money took the total amount of the bank bailout package of $700 billion and added that to the proposed 2009 economic stimulus spending estimation at the time of $819 billion - resulting in a total bailout package of $1.519 trillion (that is quite a staggering figure). Dividing that number by 156.3 million, the total number of U.S. workers who filed federal income tax returns in 2008, that number equaled $9,718.49 per U.S. taxpayer, or roughly the equivalent of a juicy $10,000 cash bailout payment for each qualified tax payer. Now that's stimulus with oomph! With $10,000 in our pockets in the form of instant windfall economic stimulus checks, it's very likely that the tremendously high amount would be sufficient to incite a major change in spending activity than a measly $600 check ever could.���� People would probably go out and actually start stimulating the economy by buying cars, purchasing TV's, paying for college studies, and going on vacations.

As a dose of devil's advocate inspired reality though, while it's very possible that $10,000 checks in every working taxpayer's hands would probably send the economy skyrocketing, it's also possible the growth could be short lived and not actually get to the true root of our current economic problems. The massive surge in consumer spending probably won't do much to solve the lingering fundamental issues surrounding our current credit crisis, which centers around a failed banking system and a failed home mortgage lending market. But then if repairing the banks and injecting confidence back into our home mortgage and credit lending markets are our primary objectives - I'm not sure the current economic stimulus proposals by President Obama, which are focused more on tax cuts and job creation and most prominently, aggressive social spending programs - will actually accomplish those goals. At least for stimulus checks, they could be able to help alleviate some of the immediate economic suffering being felt by ordinary consumers - many of whom are fighting to stay alive, with a great deal currently resorting to desperate emergency fund measures like 0% credit card offers, balance transfers, and risky high interest payday loans.

I'm curious as to everyone's opinion on the wisdom of a second stimulus check (if it ever happened). What's your take? Would substantially higher stimulus checks of $1,000, or possibly even as high as $10,000, actually encourage you to spend the money (thereby stimulating the economy) instead of merely saving the amount or using it to pay down debt? How would your decision compare to how you actually spent your previous 2008 tax rebate stimulus check?

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392 Responses to “Second Stimulus Check For Obama 2009 Economic Stimulus Package?” 

  1. Anthony says:

    This is ridiculous. I've been reading these posts for over an hour and, with the exception of a couple of realists, you all are just a bunch of greedy, lazy whiners. "I'm a single mom," "I'm going to have my car repossessed," I can't pay my mortgage." Wahhhhh!! Shut the hell up and take some responsibility for your lives. I can tell you right now, without a shred of doubt, that you lazy, greedy bastards will not be receiving one red cent from the government in the form of a stimulus payment in 2009 (or probably ever again). Why do you think that the US government should take care of your sorry asses? Because you all have a false sense of entitlement. The government is only good for taking your money. I'm personally getting sick of all the pissing and moaning from all of you socialist idiots. You are the retards that voted this piece of crap into office to begin with, and now you're bitching about it. You all made your choice, so you can do one of three things: 1. Shut up and deal with it. 2. Get off your fat, lazy asses and do something about it (and I mean actually DO something. Complaining is not the same thing. 3. Move somewhere else so at least I don't have to listen to the excrement spewing from your mouths.

  2. Michael says:

    Amen Anthony. I don't mean to put others down, but we don't live in china, so don't expect the government to take care of you. That's not their job. The government's job is to secure our borders and provide a sound currency. Both of which they have failed miserably at so what makes you think they are going to be able to fix anything else...? Stop the entitlement and the welfare state thinking, that's the path to socialism and loss of freedoms. I think it's hilarious that everyone is boobing about stimulus checks... don't you realize that that money comes from printing more money, and borrowing from china? You people of all should know (the people saying they need the check) that you can't pay off credit cards with more credit cards. That's exactly what the United States is doing and you're encouraging it.

  3. Lakisha says:

    Stop bashing President Obama. He's the greatest thing that's ever happened to this country and I don't appreciate all the negative attacks on him and his policies

    He's doing the best he can and will get us out of this mess that Bush started. Yeah I'd like a second stimulus check or whatever...but it's ain't happening for now. Let's support the Prez instead of spreading negative comments on blogs and online! Yes we can!!!

  4. Anthony says:

    Screw you, Lakisha! Why the hell should I support somebody I don't believe in? That's exactly how socialism and communism get started. "Support our candidate or we'll hurt you." As far as Bush starting the current situation this country is in...EEEEHHHHH!!!!! Wrong again. I don't recall George W. piloting any of the 4 planes that attacked our once-great nation on 9/11, and I certainly don't remember him telling any of you welfare-loving attention whores to live outside your own means. Why don't you whining beggars just admit that you screwed up and now you have to live with the consequences of your own actions. Besides, the problem with the housing market began waaaaayyy back when Slick Willy was in office. (Clinton for the retards.)

    Oh, and I don't particularly care if you appreciate negative attacks on Obama or not. Since the attacks are not aimed at you, then you have no reason to take offense. This guy is going to be the financial downfall of this country; and that isn't opinion, rumor, or speculation; it's fact. If you can't handle a little healthy debate and criticism, then I'd say you have bigger issues.

  5. mary says:

    my story is like everyone else out there, living from paycheck to paycheck. not knowing whats tomorrow will bring. when will things get better. i agree with another stimulus check ( not tax breaks ) what was the talk about a check to offset the gas prices or did that turn out to be part of the tax break. we are in need of a bail out of some kind just like banks automakers

  6. Anthony says:

    Don't get me wrong. I completely agree that the country and it's citizens need something a little more tangible than imaginary tax breaks, and I wholeheartedly disagree with the government's decisions to bail out the banks and to take over GM. I do not, however, believe that I or my family, or anyone's families should be financially responsible for bailing out people that have no common sense. If you racked up the credit card charges, bought a car or house that you knew you either couldn't or barely could afford, and didn't give any thought to your economic security for the future, well then, that's your own damn fault and you probably deserve whatever you get. If you are one of the hundreds of thousands Americans that have lost your job or taken a pay cut so that our illustrious leaders could "spread the wealth," then I sympathize with you and I emplore you to stand up and let your voices be heard. Enough is enough. Let GM fail! Let Morgan-Stanley fail! Part of capitalism and democracy is having the freedom to fail. If you can't run your business profitably, if you don't know how to make money, then you have no business running a business. Don't make the taxpayers responsible for your incompetence.

  7. Stimulus Check says:

    this stimulus thing has gotten way out of hand. I'm not sure if it is really doing what obama was planning on it doing int he first place

  8. Social Security Stimulus Check says:

    Since I haven't heard too much on this particular upcoming news, I'll plug what I know about the $250 Social Security Stimulus Check for 2009 here. Here goes:

    For those of you who don't know, the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009 gave all social security benefit recipients a one-time $250 payment. Those who qualify will get the stimulus check the same way you are getting your current Social Security and Supplemental Security Income (SSI) benefit payments. If you get it by paper check, you will receive the payment as a separate check. Likewise, if you get the payment by bank direct deposit, you will get it as a separate direct deposit. Visit the Social Security Administration's website for the One Time Economic Recovery Payments information page to get more info if you've not already yet received your Social Security stimulus check.

    Basically, anyone who is entitled to SSI or to any of the Social Security benefits at any time during Nov 2008 thru Jan 2009 is eligible to receive a small but handy $250 Social Security Stimulus Payment check. If you are a recipient of any of the following benefits, you qualify:

    -Retirement Social Security benefits.
    -Wifes or Husband's Social Security benefits.
    -Disabled Adult Child benefits (but not other child's benefits).
    -Widow's, Widower's, Mothers, Fathers, Parents Social Security Benefits.
    -Disability Insurance benefit.
    -Special age 72 benefits.

    Children qualify for the $250 Social Security payment only if they are disabled and qualify for SSI.

  9. Simon says:

    Well, speaking of economic stimulus packages....don't forget the $8,000 tax credit for first-time home buyers that was included in the economic stimulus bill signed by President Barack Obama in February 2009. That certainly ought to be more substantial than the measly $250 Social Security Stimulus Check.

    What is one supposed to do with just $250 anyway? That's like the cost of a Playstation 3, Xbox 360, or Nintendo Wii..

  10. Pia T. says:

    Now I can't... No WON'T say anything bad about Obama cause I agree with Lakisha says.... Don't ya think we should as least give the guy a break and run the country. I mean gees He only been in office for 6 mths... That's not enough time to change everything going wrong. Bush had 8 years to screw it up. No I'm not blaming Bush for all our troubles but since he was the leader of the country it was his responsibility to take care of us.
    Sorry got off topic.... the stimulas checks....I read that part of you think that we (the people) shouldn't get the check and rely on the government. Well when it comes to money THIS country has; WETHE PEOPLE should be able to decide where at least part of that money goes. The goverenment give car dealerships and other big companies money, that we all know part of it get pocketed and CEO's go on early vacations and stuff. I mean look around, more and more families are having troubles just keeping bills paid and food on the table trying NOT to rely on the government. When we can barely get by with only getting the neccesities... how do they expects us to get new vechiles when this country's credit sux, banks won't give loans not to mention many Americans are getting laid off. It's not the we can't work, it's that there is no work. The government needs to get us more jobs or make it more affordable to go to school for a trade or a new trade. Then we wouldn't be wondering about stimulas checks, we would be able to work and support ourselves. Then at the end of the year for income tax we can use it for something fun, what ever that may be for you, a cruise, a road trip, shopping, saving it, haveing a big party... what ever you want. But that's not the way it it right now, well unless you're already rich then chances are you're not worried about it anyways, but for the middle and lower class it would be nice to do something different besides work, sleep, pay bills, work, pay taxes and die!
    This is only my opinion but Stimulas money should be spent to boost the economy but where it's spent should be our decision. We need more jobs and places for kids to go. I've seen so many parks and arcades torn down to build some new buisness, and people wonder why the kids now a days are ending up in gangs and killing people over stupid crap. Again this was only my opinion and thanx for listening....well reading. Bye

  11. Anthony says:

    You WON'T say anything bad about YObama because you are probably a tree-hugging, bleeding-heart liberal who thinks that the government is in place to serve you and only you. DON'T GO THROUGH LIFE THINKING THAT THE GOVERNMENT OWES YOU A HANDOUT JUST BECAUSE YOU ARE THERE. For fuck's sake, sheeple! Take responsibility for yourselves! You are all the most pathetic bunch of whiners I have ever encountered (and I've worked at the Pentagon.)

    What you really need to do, Pia T., is spend a little less time in front of the television, put down your crack pipe, shut the fuck up and work on your tenuous grasp of the English language.

    Would you like to know the real reason that kids today are the way they are? It's because of lazy jack-asses like you who are too busy teaching your own kids to take advantage of the welfare system and believe everything they see on CNN. Obama is a tired piece of shit that has no business anywhere near Washington DC. If you have a problem with that, tough. Where is your Messiah with all of the crap he promised? Give him a chance? He's had his chance, and, in my opinion, he has failed, and lied, and waffled. He is a typical politician, nothing more. He will tell you exactly what you want to hear and do the opposite. Pull your heads out of your asses, sheeple.

    Now, I'm not saying that Bush was a road scholar or anything, either. Ever time the man opens his mouth I can feel the intelligence being sucked out of the room. But for someone that was preaching change for 6 months, Obama has only convinced me that he is just like every other politician in the world. He is a liar, and a thief, and he will tell you anything you want him to as long as it shuts you up.

    And if you don't like that, then bite me.

  12. RELYINGONMYSELF says:

    Simon, The $8000 first time home buyers tax credit is something that will be taken back over over so many years when you file your taxes. I spoke with my financial advisor on this and was told only to take it if you need the money right now. I, fortunately, do not but if you are in situation where you get money back every year and won't have to worry about paying it back in the future then go for it.

  13. Sad isn't it says:

    Boost the economy with a 2nd stimulas check; sounds good but think about where the money goes...

    If we spend the money at Wal-Mart, it will all go to China.
    If we spend it on gasoline it will all go to the Arabs.
    If we spend it on fruit and vegetables it will all go to Mexico,
    Honduras, and Guatemala.
    If we purchase a good car it will all go to Japan.
    If we purchase electronic gadgets it will all go to Taiwan or Malaysia.

    We need to keep that money at home to strengthen our economy here, so
    the best way to spend it is for prostitutes and beer, the only truly
    functional businesses still in the US.

    My name is Elliot Spitzer and I approved this ad.

  14. dd says:

    so what, just give me my money!!!

  15. lisa says:

    I think it would be great to get a stimulus check. My husband and I would use it for a home. I just hope no matter what OBAMA does are economy will get better and those out of work can get back to work. I pray for all of us...

  16. Kathy says:

    I could really use a stimulas check as my ex left me high and dry(had my car repoed and no place for me to live)I woud help me alot to get back on my feet

  17. Frances Hall says:

    I'm a State employee who has not received even a cost of living raise since 2005. Our pay rate is already below that of private industry and now the State is implementing a 2-5% pay reduction. I'm 59 years old and, because my ex-husband spent all my "my" money, I have very little saved and retirement is only a dream. I will have to work the rest of my life. I do not own a home and cannot afford one at the ridiculously high prices. I would not quality as a "first time" buyer. I cannot afford to replace my old vehicle, so I continue to patch and repair it. I've worked hard to pay off all credit cards. I owe $300 on my final one and it will be paid this month. I've been responsible with my paltry salary. I'm attempting to get a college education, but it is difficult. At my age, I don't know that it will help much. I always thought I'd always be a stay-at-home wife and mom....who knew?

    The '08 stimulus check was not enough to assist me with needed purchases. I think some of it went for another car repair. $10,000? Now that would be enough to help. I could at least buy a better and safer vehicle. I've wondered all along why GOV didn't give the tax payer more of its own money back to them to "stimulate" the economy. Instead, the same people who have victimized us are being rewarded! It's instulting to me. The underhanded tactics of the credit cards companies have caused enumberable problems for the consumer and have kept us locked in a prison of debt which has made it almost impossible for many of us to struggle out of. I'm one of the lucky ones. After being victimized by a company owned by Bank of America...I went to work to get rid of them! NOW...where's my money going? To rescue any company that has intentionally robbed from me is ridiculous! Yep...here we go again: rob from the poor - give to the rich. How much more burden is going to be placed out our backs before we rise up and do something about it? I think not much more!

  18. Manbearpig says:

    I say the government should seize a portion of the multi billion dollar individuals
    (bill Gates ect.) to help stimulate the entire US. If not seize at least come to an agreement. That would give anyone with half a brain to bring back the economy and more. Give people a chance to start their own businesses. It would forever change the US. Image a world where there wouldn't be such thing as a stimulus package because nobody would need it. The insanely rich people would be reimbursed of coarse, after millions of people start up there own businesses.

    A 300 dollar check will not forever change the US. because we will just need another one next year. 100,000 dollar check would..unless your 100,000 in debt.

    It costs money, to make money.

  19. Anthony says:

    Manbearpig, (love the South Park reference, btw) how can you possibly justify seizing assets from ANY private citizen? All you're doing is promoting Socialism. Remember the Soviet Union? Socialism doesn't work, period. And I didn't serve this nation in the military for 5 years and take 2 bullets for my country just to have liberal, communist morons like yourself turn this once-great nation into a socialist state bound to fail. If you want to "spread the wealth" so much, why don't you move to China, North Korea, or Cuba? Believe me, you won't be missed.

  20. Anthony says:

    One more thing...

    All of you IDIOTS out there,

    STOP BEGGING FOR MONEY LIKE SO MANY DOGS BEGGING FOR SCRAPS!!!!!

    TAKE SOME PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY AND SHUT THE HELL UP!!!!!

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