Comments on: Female Bosses and the Queen Bee Syndrome http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/ Personal Finance Beyond Credit Cards and Balance Transfers Tue, 06 Jan 2009 13:37:40 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.7 hourly 1 By: Joanelle http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-43988 Joanelle Sat, 06 Dec 2008 14:17:55 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-43988 The Queen Bee syndrome is actually based on the fact that most companies will allow limited number of women at the top - look at the Board of Directors, senior management group, etc. The "boys" control things and consequently women protect their individual jobs, roles and position to the extent that they keep other women out -the "boys" are very good at setting us up against each other - they don't have to do anything anymore - they have us doing it for them - protecting their turf and keeping us out! They've gotten so good at it that many women will tell you they don't want a "woman for a boss" The Queen Bee syndrome is actually based on the fact that most companies will allow limited number of women at the top - look at the Board of Directors, senior management group, etc. The “boys” control things and consequently women protect their individual jobs, roles and position to the extent that they keep other women out -the “boys” are very good at setting us up against each other - they don’t have to do anything anymore - they have us doing it for them - protecting their turf and keeping us out!

They’ve gotten so good at it that many women will tell you they don’t want a “woman for a boss”

]]> By: Jean Z. http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-36420 Jean Z. Sun, 19 Oct 2008 05:26:07 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-36420 I work with an Alpha Female CSR that is the assigned CSR for one of the company's largest accounts. Problem is, I may not be an alpha female, but I don't take any crap from someone who is on my same level. She actually went to my boss and his boss to discuss the things I should be doing for her, without including me at all. I can only assume she wanted me to sock her in the face. I refuse to do any of it. If she were smart, she'd find a doormat, not try to convert me into one. She can be as persistent as she likes, I'm just not wired to be a doormat. She thinks she wants me to be her assistant. She needs to be certain of that. No one can stand her. I think many people have not articulated to themselves why they can't stand her, but her constant manipulation and "acquisition" of friends, just to have people to manipulate is so transparent. Everyone hopes she falls flat on her face. I work with an Alpha Female CSR that is the assigned CSR for one of the company’s largest accounts. Problem is, I may not be an alpha female, but I don’t take any crap from someone who is on my same level. She actually went to my boss and his boss to discuss the things I should be doing for her, without including me at all. I can only assume she wanted me to sock her in the face. I refuse to do any of it. If she were smart, she’d find a doormat, not try to convert me into one. She can be as persistent as she likes, I’m just not wired to be a doormat. She thinks she wants me to be her assistant. She needs to be certain of that. No one can stand her. I think many people have not articulated to themselves why they can’t stand her, but her constant manipulation and “acquisition” of friends, just to have people to manipulate is so transparent. Everyone hopes she falls flat on her face.

]]> By: Pat H http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-36126 Pat H Fri, 17 Oct 2008 17:06:26 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-36126 There can be only one “Queen Bee” in the colony and any threat to the queen’s position will draw her ire. I had to learn this the hard way. Many of the positions I’ve had during my career resulted in the same thing if my immediate supervisor was female. Usually did not happen with male supervisors because, for the most part, there was not a power play going on between male and female. If I may draw this analogy, in motherhood, there can be only one female who rules the roost and dictates how the household should be run; you know, the planning, the execution of those plans the "do as I say and not as I do" philosophy. It is wise for other females to keep their opinions to themselves when it comes to giving advise on how another woman’s home should be run. Bottom line, women have a competitive streak no different than their male counterparts. They exist in a "no-share zone" And so I think that women in the workplace tend to be more mentally vicious and vindictive in their dealings with other females if one perceives the other as threatening competition. And don't even think about usurping the queen's authority when it comes to dealing with the same males with whom the queen interacts. There will NEVER be the "good old girl" network in the workplace. It is not in our nature. Women stand alone and are nurturers to their offspring (underlings) and cannot share their charges with another woman unless it is in a subordinate capacity. Call me nuts but I think there are some parallels there. Strongly opinioned and independently thinking women will always have a difficult time working together because of a matter of mutual respect and control. A difficult thing to achieve for sure. That's not a put down but an observation from years and years of experience in the workplace. I do acknowledge that there are exceptions, however, and when that does happen, it can be a beautiful thing though it isn't often. There can be only one “Queen Bee” in the colony and any threat to the queen’s position will draw her ire. I had to learn this the hard way. Many of the positions I’ve had during my career resulted in the same thing if my immediate supervisor was female. Usually did not happen with male supervisors because, for the most part, there was not a power play going on between male and female.

If I may draw this analogy, in motherhood, there can be only one female who rules the roost and dictates how the household should be run; you know, the planning, the execution of those plans the “do as I say and not as I do” philosophy. It is wise for other females to keep their opinions to themselves when it comes to giving advise on how another woman’s home should be run. Bottom line, women have a competitive streak no different than their male counterparts. They exist in a “no-share zone”

And so I think that women in the workplace tend to be more mentally vicious and vindictive in their dealings with other females if one perceives the other as threatening competition. And don’t even think about usurping the queen’s authority when it comes to dealing with the same males with whom the queen interacts.

There will NEVER be the “good old girl” network in the workplace. It is not in our nature. Women stand alone and are nurturers to their offspring (underlings) and cannot share their charges with another woman unless it is in a subordinate capacity. Call me nuts but I think there are some parallels there. Strongly opinioned and independently thinking women will always have a difficult time working together because of a matter of mutual respect and control. A difficult thing to achieve for sure. That’s not a put down but an observation from years and years of experience in the workplace. I do acknowledge that there are exceptions, however, and when that does happen, it can be a beautiful thing though it isn’t often.

]]> By: Pat H http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-36124 Pat H Fri, 17 Oct 2008 16:35:07 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-36124 there can be only one "Queen Bee" in the colony and any threat to the queen's position will draw her ire. I had to learn this the hard way. Any position I've ever had during my career resulted in the same thing where my immediate supervisor was female. Usually did not happen with male supervisors because there was not a power play going on. As with motherhood, there can be only one female who rules the roost and dictates how the household or office should be run. It is wise for other females to keep their opinions to themselves when it comes to giving advise on how another woman's homes or businesses should run. Bottom line, women have there can be only one “Queen Bee” in the colony and any threat to the queen’s position will draw her ire. I had to learn this the hard way. Any position I’ve ever had during my career resulted in the same thing where my immediate supervisor was female. Usually did not happen with male supervisors because there was not a power play going on. As with motherhood, there can be only one female who rules the roost and dictates how the household or office should be run. It is wise for other females to keep their opinions to themselves when it comes to giving advise on how another woman’s homes or businesses should run. Bottom line, women have

]]> By: frances Petrie http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-32025 frances Petrie Sat, 27 Sep 2008 05:04:10 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-32025 The Queen Bee where I work is the Office Manager. She is making me like Hell. I have been depressed over the last year. I am very successful at my job, I receive good feed back from Clients and staff. I have yet to hear her say that I am doing a good job. The feed back I get from her is petty criticisms. Recently I had my appraisal with her, she did not tell me that I would have to complete an agreed objectives form after the appraisal. Had I known I would have taken notes. I asked her the next day for a copy of her written evaluation and she said it was closed and had been sent to the HR Dept. I called the HR Dept and they said this was lies, he scanned it and sent it to me. My grading on the appraisal was mainly marked - G with the odd G+ and a good few G-! I also received the copy of the other appraisee and her grading was mainly E (Excellent) she is one on our Senior Lawyers. Also, the Office Manager said that I had to be careful what I discussed with Clients, this was not mentioned at the appraisal! The problem first started when she hired an uneducated person to cover reception. She could not speak proper English and certainly could not write proper English. We lost so much potential Clients, the phones were not ringing the conference rooms were empty. The Office Manager was determined to keep her on reception, this is a disaster for an International Law Company as the receptionist is the first point of contact for the company! We has so many complaints from Clients and indeed our Head Office in London. After four months she approached me and asked if I would take over reception. This I did! This was my biggest mistake. She can see how successful I have been and Lawyers tell her how good I am, this she does not like. The person that was hired for reception now has an admin position, OM does all her emails and no one is allowed to ask her do anything unless we go through the OM. We know why this is, she wants to assess whether the admin person can do the job! Needless to say I am now looking for another job as I have had enough. I know the Lawyers will be furious that this Queen Bee has forced me out of the hive!! The Queen Bee where I work is the Office Manager. She is making me like Hell. I have been depressed over the last year. I am very successful at my job, I receive good feed back from Clients and staff. I have yet to hear her say that I am doing a good job. The feed back I get from her is petty criticisms. Recently I had my appraisal with her, she did not tell me that I would have to complete an agreed objectives form after the appraisal. Had I known I would have taken notes. I asked her the next day for a copy of her written evaluation and she said it was closed and had been sent to the HR Dept. I called the HR Dept and they said this was lies, he scanned it and sent it to me. My grading on the appraisal was mainly marked - G with the odd G+ and a good few G-! I also received the copy of the other appraisee and her grading was mainly E (Excellent) she is one on our Senior Lawyers. Also, the Office Manager said that I had to be careful what I discussed with Clients, this was not mentioned at the appraisal!
The problem first started when she hired an uneducated person to cover reception. She could not speak proper English and certainly could not write proper English. We lost so much potential Clients, the phones were not ringing the conference rooms were empty. The Office Manager was determined to keep her on reception, this is a disaster for an International Law Company as the receptionist is the first point of contact for the company! We has so many complaints from Clients and indeed our Head Office in London. After four months she approached me and asked if I would take over reception. This I did! This was my biggest mistake. She can see how successful I have been and Lawyers tell her how good I am, this she does not like.
The person that was hired for reception now has an admin position, OM does all her emails and no one is allowed to ask her do anything unless we go through the OM. We know why this is, she wants to assess whether the admin person can do the job!

Needless to say I am now looking for another job as I have had enough. I know the Lawyers will be furious that this Queen Bee has forced me out of the hive!!

]]> By: italiana http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-26975 italiana Wed, 03 Sep 2008 13:39:59 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-26975 The queen bee where I work is the Executive Secretary who manipulates male executive staff into doing her bidding. She also gossips about female staff to them. It's hell. I am looking for other work. I don't give a damn about justifying her behavior based on sexism in the workplace. She undercuts productivity and morale. And the executive staff fails to stand up to her. The queen bee where I work is the Executive Secretary who manipulates male executive staff into doing her bidding. She also gossips about female staff to them. It’s hell. I am looking for other work. I don’t give a damn about justifying her behavior based on sexism in the workplace. She undercuts productivity and morale. And the executive staff fails to stand up to her.

]]> By: Jo Christie-Smith http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-23845 Jo Christie-Smith Mon, 11 Aug 2008 14:15:58 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-23845 I agree with narcisstic.claptrap, I think it is people who defend their territory when they are in positions of authority not just women. It's just that this behaviour is expected and celebrated as being very masculine and therefore unremarkable when a man does it but abnormal when a women does it. That is certainly my experience I have had good experiences working for women and bad ones; likewise I have had good and bad experiences working for men. If I had to say which were the most defensive of their position, then it would probably be the men. It was like someone commented on my blog when I was writing about Hillary Clinton a couple of months ago...they were criticising her for 'lusting for power'. I mean, would you nominate a candidate that wasn't that fussed about power? Do we really think John McCain or Barack Obama are not interested in power? I agree with narcisstic.claptrap, I think it is people who defend their territory when they are in positions of authority not just women. It’s just that this behaviour is expected and celebrated as being very masculine and therefore unremarkable when a man does it but abnormal when a women does it.

That is certainly my experience I have had good experiences working for women and bad ones; likewise I have had good and bad experiences working for men. If I had to say which were the most defensive of their position, then it would probably be the men.

It was like someone commented on my blog when I was writing about Hillary Clinton a couple of months ago…they were criticising her for ‘lusting for power’. I mean, would you nominate a candidate that wasn’t that fussed about power? Do we really think John McCain or Barack Obama are not interested in power?

]]> By: narcissistic.claptrap http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-23731 narcissistic.claptrap Sun, 10 Aug 2008 14:27:41 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-23731 @Karen Bune: "The Queen Bee Syndrome is definitely alive and well. Most women supervisors are threatened by highly educated, successful, and competent women who work under them" In my experience, *people* defend their territory when they arrive at a position of power. Men do this aggressively, every damn day, but it only gets a special label when women engage in the behavior. I am approximately peer-level with a man 20 years my senior (he outranks me slightly, but my CEO tends to side with me when a tie-breaking vote is needed). This man resents my Ivy League education and my confidence, and does everything he can to undermine my authority, despite the fact that doing so risks doing active harm to the goals of our non-profit organization. Strangely, no one refers to him as a "Queen Bee". The last time I was promoted, my primary competition was a male 10 years my senior. I approached our competition with a good-natured "may the best human win" attitude; by contrast, he practiced political exclusion, back-stabbing, and general snarkiness. Luckily, I have a (male) CEO who recognizes ability and contribution. The day after my competitor was informed that he now reported to me, he left copies of his resume sitting in the printer for all to see. Within 6 months, he was gone. You can bet your ass no one called him a "Queen Bee". I am at director level in my organization. I have promoted 7 women and 0 men to management positions within our organization over the past 3 years, and all promotions went to the best qualified and most competent candidates. I also spend a lot of time trying to keep my managers visible to our CEO, arranging face time whenever there is justification to do so. I see 6 out of 7 of my female managers doing the same thing within their own departments. The 7th probably fits the "queen bee" stereotype, much to my disappointment. I also had three strong and supportive female bosses (supervisor, manager, and director) during my brief foray into the corporate world in the mid-90s. Insecure schmucks come in all shapes and sizes, and some of them are female. I wonder how many of the women who "prefer to work for men" have entertained the notion that those men are simply not intimidate by them because they don't consider them serious competition. @Karen Bune: “The Queen Bee Syndrome is definitely alive and well. Most women supervisors are threatened by highly educated, successful, and competent women who work under them”

In my experience, *people* defend their territory when they arrive at a position of power. Men do this aggressively, every damn day, but it only gets a special label when women engage in the behavior.

I am approximately peer-level with a man 20 years my senior (he outranks me slightly, but my CEO tends to side with me when a tie-breaking vote is needed). This man resents my Ivy League education and my confidence, and does everything he can to undermine my authority, despite the fact that doing so risks doing active harm to the goals of our non-profit organization. Strangely, no one refers to him as a “Queen Bee”.

The last time I was promoted, my primary competition was a male 10 years my senior. I approached our competition with a good-natured “may the best human win” attitude; by contrast, he practiced political exclusion, back-stabbing, and general snarkiness. Luckily, I have a (male) CEO who recognizes ability and contribution. The day after my competitor was informed that he now reported to me, he left copies of his resume sitting in the printer for all to see. Within 6 months, he was gone. You can bet your ass no one called him a “Queen Bee”.

I am at director level in my organization. I have promoted 7 women and 0 men to management positions within our organization over the past 3 years, and all promotions went to the best qualified and most competent candidates. I also spend a lot of time trying to keep my managers visible to our CEO, arranging face time whenever there is justification to do so. I see 6 out of 7 of my female managers doing the same thing within their own departments. The 7th probably fits the “queen bee” stereotype, much to my disappointment.

I also had three strong and supportive female bosses (supervisor, manager, and director) during my brief foray into the corporate world in the mid-90s.

Insecure schmucks come in all shapes and sizes, and some of them are female. I wonder how many of the women who “prefer to work for men” have entertained the notion that those men are simply not intimidate by them because they don’t consider them serious competition.

]]> By: Renee http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-23408 Renee Wed, 06 Aug 2008 22:22:44 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-23408 The queen bee syndrome is alive and well and leaves the rest of drone females running for cover for fear of being caught in the cross fire. The queen bee syndrome is alive and well and leaves the rest of drone females running for cover for fear of being caught in the cross fire.

]]> By: earlgreyrooibos http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-23390 earlgreyrooibos Wed, 06 Aug 2008 18:40:38 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-23390 There's definitely no Queen Bee issue at my workplace. It's not a big, cohesive, sisterhood fest either, but there's no problem with our executive director acting like a Queen Bee. On a side note, the term "Queen Bee" has also been used to describe a certain type of particularly malicious, passive-aggresive, "popular" high school girl. I wonder which came first? I'm sure they're related, but it would be interesting to see how the term evolved. (Found this through the Carnival of Feminists, btw) There’s definitely no Queen Bee issue at my workplace. It’s not a big, cohesive, sisterhood fest either, but there’s no problem with our executive director acting like a Queen Bee.

On a side note, the term “Queen Bee” has also been used to describe a certain type of particularly malicious, passive-aggresive, “popular” high school girl. I wonder which came first? I’m sure they’re related, but it would be interesting to see how the term evolved.

(Found this through the Carnival of Feminists, btw)

]]> By: Dana http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-22816 Dana Fri, 01 Aug 2008 23:40:37 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-22816 I too have been victimized by a queen bee. The Queen Bee was promoted to a very high position in the company. She is now trying desperately to do away with ALL the female employees that she did not personally hire herself. The ones that threaten her. If you are educated, articulate, good looking, A-type personality, NOT white trash, have more talent & brains than her (not difficult) then you are on her list of people to demolish. I totally don't get it. Females already have a really tough time getting ahead in the job world. I don't think in my lifetime or generations to follow that we'll ever see a dent in it. Some cos are ok, most are still very not with the program when dealing with the queen bee. When you have Co. owners that back and support the queen bee, then you are F**ked! I am not saying females are not promoted, its that when they are this "queen Bee" takes control and those above her pay no attention. When she is in charge of hiring, she will only hire those that she "feels" are below her. In this case, its those who are dumber than her (but have enough skill to do their job) those who are fatter than her. (we're talk'n 400lbs;) or plain just frumpy folks who are whimpy and pose no threat at all to her. I have left the co. since, as I know of no other way to remedy this situation. It just irritates me to all H**L that a fellow female could be this way. Where did the "sisterhood" go? I know she always gave the good jobs to the men so that they would look up to her. God forbid should she give a good job to a competitive female...she might do a damn good job and "out shine the boss". Most bosses would relish in the fact that they had an outstanding employee in their command. I would get isolated, bullied and lied to. There is no solution. I wish someone here would come up with a solution. I can't grow a p***s! HELP!!!! I too have been victimized by a queen bee.

The Queen Bee was promoted to a very high position in the company. She is now trying desperately to do away with ALL the female employees that she did not personally hire herself. The ones that threaten her.

If you are educated, articulate, good looking, A-type personality, NOT white trash, have more talent & brains than her (not difficult) then you are on her list of people to demolish.

I totally don’t get it. Females already have a really tough time getting ahead in the job world. I don’t think in my lifetime or generations to follow that we’ll ever see a dent in it. Some cos are ok, most are still very not with the program when dealing with the queen bee. When you have Co. owners that back and support the queen bee, then you are F**ked! I am not saying females are not promoted, its that when they are this “queen Bee” takes control and those above her pay no attention.

When she is in charge of hiring, she will only hire those that she “feels” are below her. In this case, its those who are dumber than her (but have enough skill to do their job) those who are fatter than her. (we’re talk’n 400lbs;) or plain just frumpy folks who are whimpy and pose no threat at all to her.

I have left the co. since, as I know of no other way to remedy this situation. It just irritates me to all H**L that a fellow female could be this way. Where did the “sisterhood” go?
I know she always gave the good jobs to the men so that they would look up to her. God forbid should she give a good job to a competitive female…she might do a damn good job and “out shine the boss”. Most bosses would relish in the fact that they had an outstanding employee in their command.
I would get isolated, bullied and lied to. There is no solution. I wish someone here would come up with a solution. I can’t grow a p***s!
HELP!!!!

]]> By: Northwest Gal http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-19154 Northwest Gal Sat, 28 Jun 2008 18:26:50 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-19154 To Raymond: Perhaps you might initiate a movement in your area/state to export more of your blue-state progressive and liberals to Utah (?) To Raymond:

Perhaps you might initiate a movement in your area/state to export more of your blue-state progressive and liberals to Utah (?)

]]> By: Raymond http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-19153 Raymond Sat, 28 Jun 2008 18:22:59 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-19153 Northwest Gal, I'm in Maryland...our state is as blue as it gets. Nothing but progressives and liberals here. Northwest Gal,

I’m in Maryland…our state is as blue as it gets. Nothing but progressives and liberals here.

]]> By: Northwest Gal http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-19150 Northwest Gal Sat, 28 Jun 2008 18:17:44 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-19150 Hi Raymond: Also, in answer to your question as to which NW town about which you initially inquired, (although the situation to which I was referring is in Utah):Seattle, Port Townsend, and Issaquah. Do you reside in the NW or are you familiar with the NW, by the way? Hi Raymond:

Also, in answer to your question as to which NW town about which you initially inquired, (although the situation to which I was referring is in Utah):Seattle, Port Townsend, and Issaquah. Do you reside in the NW or are you familiar with the NW, by the way?

]]> By: Northwest Gal http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/comment-page-1/#comment-19149 Northwest Gal Sat, 28 Jun 2008 18:05:51 +0000 http://www.moneybluebook.com/female-bosses-and-the-queen-bee-syndrome/#comment-19149 In answer to Raymond's question: Still considering myself a NW Gal (at heart), the state in which we now reside and was the subject of my earlier lengthy post is.....Utah. Thank you for your question and the opportunity you provided me to clarify my previous remarks. The NW was a positive environment in which to work and do business---speaking as a woman. As well, it was a most beautiful state, in my opinion. Abolustely loved the experience of living there. To me, I am unable to think of a more lovely place to live, frankly. Best wishes, NW Gal In answer to Raymond’s question: Still considering myself a NW Gal (at heart), the state in which we now reside and was the subject of my earlier lengthy post is…..Utah.

Thank you for your question and the opportunity you provided me to clarify my previous remarks. The NW was a positive environment in which to work and do business—speaking as a woman. As well, it was a most beautiful state, in my opinion. Abolustely loved the experience of living there. To me, I am unable to think of a more lovely place to live, frankly. Best wishes,
NW Gal

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